Talk:Ostracoderm

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Ostracoderm article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Palaeontology High‑importance

	Paleontology portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Palaeontology, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of palaeontology-related topics and create a standardized, informative, comprehensive and easy-to-use resource on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PalaeontologyWikipedia:WikiProject PalaeontologyTemplate:WikiProject PalaeontologyPalaeontology articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

Fishes High‑importance

	Fish portal This article is part of WikiProject Fishes, an attempt to organise a detailed guide to all topics related to Fish taxa. To participate, you can edit the attached article, or contribute further at WikiProject Fishes. This project is an offshoot of the WikiProject Tree of Life.FishesWikipedia:WikiProject FishesTemplate:WikiProject FishesFishes articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

A fact from Ostracoderm appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 21 October 2004. The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that ostracoderms are the earliest known vertebrate animals?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2004/October.

Wikipedia

Untitled

Article states: "The gills of osrtacoderms were used not for feeding, but for respiration." Isn't this the normal use for gills? What am I missing? Jeffrey L. Whitledge 22:09, 2004 Oct 20 (UTC)

This is the first time "gills" were used solely for respiration. Previously they were part of the feeding apparatus. At least that is what's meant. If I'm wrong, please LMK.--DanielCD 12:12, 21 Oct 2004 (UTC)

That's a lot clearer now, thanks. (I just hope that it's true! :) ) Jeffrey L. Whitledge 21:06, 2004 Oct 22 (UTC)

References

I'm going to look for some refs. If you would like to nominate this for deletion on those grounds, please message me first. --SpencerTC 03:31, 25 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

What, nominate for deletion on the grounds that you're looking for refs? :) --M1ss1ontomars2k4 | T | C | @ 03:58, 16 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Ostracoderm polyphyly

Ostracoderms are not a good evolutionary taxon.

"There is a number of taxa of fossil jawless vertebrates which were formerly referred to as the "ostracoderms" ("shell-skinned") because most of them possess an extensive, bony endo- and exoskeleton. The "ostracoderms" lived from the Early ordovician (about 480 million years ago) to the Late Devonian (about 370 million years ago). The relationships of the various groups of "ostracoderms" has been the subject of considerable debate since the mid-nineteenth Century, and the theory of relationship proposed here is far from definitive, yet the best supported by the currently available data. The "ostracoderms" are represented by five major groups, four of which are almost certainly clades: the Heterostraci, Osteostraci, Galeaspida, Anaspida, and Thelodonti (the monophyly of the latter being debated, Thelodonti page). In addition, there are minor groups which only include a few species: the Arandaspida, Astraspida, Eriptychiida, and Pituriaspida. The Arandaspida, Astraspida, Eriptychiida, and Heterostraci are regarded as forming a clade, the Pteraspidomorphi. Some monospecific genera, Jamoytius, Endeiolepis, and Euphanerops, formerly referred to the Anaspida, are now removed from that clade and may be more closely related to lampreys (see Hyperoartia)."

From http://tolweb.org/Vertebrata

Yes, it is an excellent evolutionary taxon, but it is not a phylogenetic taxon. The grpup is most certainly ancestral to the jawed vertebrates, and thus form an evolutionary grade of advanced jawless fishes. Petter Bøckman (talk) 08:47, 12 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Fishes

Should the first line not be 'fish' not 'fishes' ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pureferret (talk • contribs) 11:02, 10 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The illustration

The illustration are shwoing to fishes, but only the one on the top is an Ostracoderm, the other one is a jawed Placoderm.84.210.60.115 (talk) 22:20, 27 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, it seems to be so. I tried to clear this question; the best prooflink that I found is this. Stas000D (talk) 14:09, 9 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

(update): the best candidate is Pterichthyodes, an antiarch placoderm. Stas000D (talk) 19:32, 9 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Contradiction?

There seem to be two contradictory statements on whether we will find ostracoderms as a group in the classification system:

The term does not often appear in classifications today because it is paraphyletic or polyphyletic, and has no phylogenetic meaning.

and

The Subclass Ostracodermi has been placed in the division Agnatha along with the extant Subclass Cyclostomata, which includes lampreys and hagfishes.

I doubt that these can both be true. Felsenst (talk) 00:27, 9 May 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Early fossils?

I removed 'The first fossil fishes that were discovered were ostracoderms", referring to 1830s, as it is clearly wrong (e.g. fossil sardine-like fish were known by Xenophanes (c. 570 – c. 478 BC). But if there is there perhaps a different, correct statement that was meant? Perhaps something closer to "the earliest known fossil fish were ostracoderms"? However, that doesn't seem quite accurate either as other Agnatha seem to be earlier. If anyone knows and can provide a reference, please consider a suitable edit. SciberDoc (talk) 14:12, 23 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]